			    TRAVELLER Digest 118

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Planetfall and Big Ships	by Steve Charlton/Avalon Software Inc
  2) Re: Planetfall and Big Ships	by merrick@RT66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
  3) Materials of Weapons	by CyHiggin@aol.com
  4) Solomani scout/courier	by "David A. Nelson" <34TYHPE@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
  5) Mapping Software (Macintosh)	by Rob_Prior@nynet.nybe.north-york.on.ca (Rob Prior)
  6) Hot Brass	by michel_v@cpx.Prograph.Com (Michel R. Vaillancourt; ACP)
  7) Deep Meson Sites and planetary defense	by michel_v@cpx.Prograph.Com (Michel R. Vaillancourt; ACP)
  8) Deep Meson Sites (Response)	by count@easynet.co.uk
  9) Re: Guns, guns, lovely guns	by Martin Fay <MFAY@fs2.cp.umist.ac.uk>
 10) Re: TRAVELLER digest 117	by CyHiggin@aol.com
 11) Re: Planetfall and Big Ships	by merrick@RT66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 30 Nov 94 15:59:52 MS
From: Steve Charlton/Avalon Software Inc
To: traveller <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: Planetfall and Big Ships
Message-ID: <9411302300.AA17034@khan.avalon.COM>

John K (the Muskrat) asks if anybody tried Planetfall yet.  I did, on November 
19.  The battle was between a mixed bag of rebels, mercenaries and Imperial
Marines on one side and a picked light company of Aslan Marines on the other.  The 
rules worked surprisingly well; the combat was quick and bloody, as all high-tech 
skirmishes should be.  Used my own morale rules, though.

General Question
Inspired by a recent post of the Azhanti High Lightning, I sat down and designed an
Atlantic-class Cruiser.  I have not, however, played Brilliant Lances, so my design
is basically a shot in the dark.  I have a few questions for all comers (including the 
folks at GDW, if so inclined):
1 - A Ship of the Line Meson Gun.  I did one with more than 600 damage at short 
range (9 hexes).  Is this too weak?
2.  Meson Screens.  This ship has a meson screen that could not be penetrated
by its own main weapon (PV about 700).  Is this out of line?
3.  Armor.  I've got about 400 points of armor on this beast.  It seemed to
me that
     I could easily armor the ship against most turret/barbette lasers (including those
     from Roger Myhre's laser list) but this would be useless against many of the big
     guns (bay lasers, Particle Accelerators, etc).  I remember a brief thread 
     on armor values, but did any consensus get reached?  I foolishly discarded the
     post before I got more info. 
4.  Damage Tables.  This is the reason I have not yet posted the design for general
    criticism/comment/ridicule.  The rules for setting up hit locations for surface and
    internal hits don't work very well on really big ships.  Has anyone come up with
    guidelines for larger ships.  
5.  Speed.  This is a 4G design, but is limited to 6 hours at full speed (24 G hours,
    48 G turns).  Too slow?  Insufficient fuel?  Space was a finite resource.

Any suggestions would be welcomed.  Hopefully, I can get the damage tables
done this weekend and post on next Monday.

scharlto@avalon.com
Oh God, he's got a spreadsheet.  
Stop him before he hurts somebody.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Nov 1994 17:53:40 -0700 (MST)
From: merrick@RT66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: Planetfall and Big Ships
Message-ID: <9412010053.AA12692@RT66.com>


Hi Steve, I thought I'd post straight to you and keep others' mailboxes
less packed. I'm really interested in your conversion of the Atlantic,
here are my comments (I've only done smaller ships to date myself, and
I'm gettin them ready to post (a bunch of Zhodani ships in the 400 -
2000 ton range).


> General Question
> Inspired by a recent post of the Azhanti High Lightning, I sat down and 
> designed an
> Atlantic-class Cruiser.  I have not, however, played Brilliant Lances, so
my 
> design
> is basically a shot in the dark.  I have a few questions for all comers 
> (including the 
> folks at GDW, if so inclined):
> 1 - A Ship of the Line Meson Gun.  I did one with more than 600 damage at
short 
> range 
>      (9 hexes).  Is this too weak?

Way to weak.  Needs to be about 2000 if I remember correctly (all our
big ship duels have been with BR, and it isn't at the office right now
:)  I guess on a CA it could be less, but I'd think it'd need to be at
least 1500.

> 2.  Meson Screens.  This ship has a meson screen that could not be penetrated 
> by its own main weapon (PV about 700).  Is this out of line?

It needs a screen big enough to stop 1500-2000, I'd say (I'll check
tonight and get back to you.

> 3.  Armor.  I've got about 400 points of armor on this beast.  It seemed to me 
> that
>      I could easily armor the ship against most turret/barbette lasers (including those
>      from Roger Myhre's laser list) but this would be useless against many of the big
>      guns (bay lasers, Particle Accelerators, etc).  I remember a brief thread on armor
>      values, but did any consensus get reached?  I foolishly discarded the post 
> before
>      I got more info. 

Armor values would be high, but only for stopping PAs--- the bay sized
lasers possible in the FFS rules are nuts.  A 140 ton laser bay would
use a fraction of the power, and be able to waste any gigantic meson gun
armed ship before it ever got close enought to shoot.  I used the
suggestion that lasers should be limited to a DE=TL*50, so the max DE at
TL-15 is 750MJ.  I think that most capitol ships in BR have armor values
around the same as the DV for the meson guns (15+).

> 4.  Damage Tables.  This is the reason I have not yet posted the design for general
>      criticism/comment/ridicule.  The rules for setting up hit locations for surface and
>      internal hits don't work very well on really big ships.  Has anyone come up with
>      guidelines for larger ships.  

I sure haven't.  What a mess, huh?  I would just eyeball it.  I usually
have an idea what the ship I'm designing looks like, so I was thinking
of just making a picture, and putting stuff where I thought it should go
(drawing the damage areas on the picture).

> 5.  Speed.  This is a 4G design, but is limited to 6 hours at full speed (24 G hours,
>      48 G turns).  Too slow?  Insufficient fuel?  Space was a finite resource.
> 
> Any suggestions would be welcomed.  Hopefully, I can get the damage tables done this 
> weekend and post on next Monday.

I standarized on building my ships with 50 g-turns on the first design
round.  Any remaining volume is used for fuel after I've don all the
other work.  Fuel is a *big* issue now (vs high guard).  Also, HG ships
have *much* more stuff on them.  (as an aside, I figured out that the
Tigress only has the surface area for 1 turret for every 300 tons... so
HG over estimates the number of weapons, maybe some of this volume could
be replaced by fuel now (it won't be enough).

Just as a general comment, I've decided that with my Zho designs, I'm
going to standardize a bunch of the equipment.  I've made all Zho
"regular" sized turrets 4 tons (3 wasn't enough at TL-14, and why would
they standardize on an inefficient size?).  I decided that larger ships
would sport 700MJ lasers in place of bay mounted energy weapons (bay
PAWS, and MGs in FFS are useless.  

******ALSO******

The crew rules are junk!  If you use them, your ship will waste the now
precious volume on crew, and quarters for them (not to mention
wkstations, etc..  The worst offender is the engineering crew.  The midu
agashaam has 4-5 time the crew if done in FFS vs HG.  The 150 Zho scout
in BL has *11* crew.  It'd have 1-4 in HG (but could run with 1).  I
decided to divided the maintenance points by 4, and I use the volume of
the powerplant, not its output in the equation.  Even doing this my
crews are larger (eng crew is 1 per 100 tons of drive in HG) than HG.

I was planning on doing a really big Zho ship soon (since there don't
seem to be any that I can find.  Let me know what your thoughts are,
since there's no reason for us both to pull our hair out on the same
problems.

-Merrick Burkhardt


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 30 Nov 1994 23:40:13 -0500
From: CyHiggin@aol.com
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Materials of Weapons
Message-ID: <941130191708_2453866@aol.com>

This is an enhancement of the original article posted by Lahtinen Antti;
I propose that as new materials and the technology to machine them
are developed, older materials become easier to machine.  After all, if
you can machine tungsten, soft steel is trivial.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In FFS weapon design section there is no information about the materials
used in weapons.  However, modern barrels and receivers can be made of
various different materials to produce lighter and more compact weapons.
 Alternative materials can be used in CPR and ETC small arms, but they
should not be used in other weapon systems.

I assume that all weapon design tables in FFS are calculated by using
Hard Steel as weapon building material.  The following table shows the
weight and price modifiers for various materials that can be used in
barrels and receivers (and tech level of introduction/tech level of
improvement).  For price mod, the number to the left is the price at TL
of INTRODUCTION, and the number on the right is the price at TL of
IMPROVEMENT on.
_______________________________________________________
 Material Type   TL      Weight  Price

 Iron            3/4     1.33    1.06/0.8   Probably used in black-powder
                                                      weapons
 Soft Steel      4/5     1.18    0.944/0.8
 Hard Steel      5/6     1.00    1.0/1.0    The most common weapon
                                                        material
 Light Alloy     6/10    0.88    2.35/2.0   Common receiver material
 Titanium Alloy  6/10    0.67    5.0/3.33   Used in rifle barrels
 Light Composite 7/8     0.44    3.5/1.75
 Comp. Laminate  8/10    0.33    4.0/1.33
 Crystaliron     10/12   0.31    4.5/1.125
 Superdense      12/14   0.27    7.0/1.0
____________________________________________________

The weight modifier is derived from FFS page 38 'Vehicle and Craft
Construction Materials' table by calculating how much material is needed
to get the same Toughness as Hard Steel has.  The price modifier is
taken directly from FFS table, and, at TL of Introduction it is not
multiplied by weight modifier to show that it is difficult and expensive
to machine tougher materials.  At TL of Improvement, it is multiplied by
the weight modifier to show that machining technology has improved
enough in the meantime that it is no longer especially difficult to
machine this material.

Note:    currently there are many weapons with Hard Steel barrels and
Light Alloy receivers, and some companies are manufacturing titanium
barrels for rifles.

Source: Lahtinen Antti <al76188@proffa.cc.tut.fi>
with modifications by Cynthia Higginbotham <cyhiggin@aol.com>



------------------------------

Date:         Wed, 30 Nov 94 22:51:55 EST
From: "David A. Nelson" <34TYHPE@CMUVM.CSV.CMICH.EDU>
To: Traveller mailing list <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: Solomani scout/courier
Message-ID:   <941130.225155.EST.34TYHPE@CMUVM>

      Hi, this is a ship I designed with your adventuring types in
   mind.

   Solomani scout/courier
   General Data
   Displacement:  100 tons           hull armor: 80
   length:  42m                      volume: 1400m
   configuration: needle AF          target size: S
   price:   110.79 MCR               Tech level: 14
   mass (loaded/empty):  1320.756/1137.1012

   engineering Data
   PowerPlant 202mw fusion power plant.  (101mw per hit) 1.2 years
   duration.
   Jump performace:  3 (280m of fuel)
   g-rating:  3G (50mw) countra-grave lifters (10mw)
   g-turns:   50G turns (110.8g usings jump fuel), 6.25M of fuel each
   maint: 36.4
2222
   Electronics
   computer:  2x TL-14 mod st computers (.5mw each) 1X TL-14 mod FB
   computer (1mw)
   commo: 300000km radio (10 hex, 10mw) 1000au maser (..,.6mw)
   avionics: TL-10 avionics
  sensors:passive ems folding array 150,000km  (5 hex, .12mw)
   active ems 360000 km (12hexes 17mw), TL-14 densitometer, TL-14
   Neutio sensor
   Controls:  8x workstations
  Armament:
   2x TL-14 150mj lazer turrets (loc: 14, 15 arcs: all; 8.4mw each
    1 crew each
 masterfire directors:  1x TL-14 MFD (6 diff mods, no msl, 6 hexs
     .182 mw 1 crew each)
2
   Accommadations
   life support:  extended (.28mw) grav compensators (6g, 10mw)
   crew: 8(2xmaneuver 1xelectorinces, 1xengineering, 1-3xGunners
            1xCommand) see notes
   Crew accommodations: 4 small staterooms (.001mw each), Double occupied
   passenger accommodations:  2 small staterooms  (.001mw each)
   cargo: 140m, one large cargo hatch
   small craft:  none
   Air locks: 1
   area         surface hit               internal explosion
    1          antenna                      electronics
    2          1 al                      (1-15) ele  (16-20)quater
   3-4         1-4 ant             (1-13)quaters (14-20) hold
   6-13                                   hold
   14-15                            (1-12) lazer turret (13-20) hold
   16-19                            (1-10)eng   (11-20) hold
    20                                         eng

system damage: jumpdrive: 2major, masterfiredirector: 2 minor, counter grav:
1 major, maneuver drive: 3 minor hits, life support 3 major, emergency life support: 2 major hits, powerplant: 2 major hits, Fuel purifaction plant: 2 major hits, small state rooms: 2 minor hits, all other systems: 1 minor hits.

Notes:   THe ship has a power excess of 1.105 mw.  this excess is often used to
 power addition system added to the standard design.
 ship crew can be reduced to 4 by one mananover crew meneuver crew member
  doubling as the electronics officer, and one gunner controlling both
 lazers from the master fire director.
  fuel purication plant take 12 hourss and 1.32mw to refine (592.5m) of
  fuel.

      feel free to send any comments to me about this ship.
                      David Nelson  " it ok we'er staff."

------------------------------

Date: 01 Dec 1994 01:29:37 GMT
From: Rob_Prior@nynet.nybe.north-york.on.ca (Rob Prior)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM, gdw.support@genie.geis.com
Subject: Mapping Software (Macintosh)
Message-ID: <199412010532.AAA05059@noc.tor.hookup.net>

I've just finished version 0.1 of my new project: a stellar mapping
application for Traveller.  So far it is restricted to mapping/generating the
mainworlds of a single subsector (which it does do in colour, though :-), and
requires a 13" monitor.

Please send me feedback on the following improvements (usefulness, which ones
you want first, etc.):

1) Add scrolling so smaller monitors can be used.

2) Handle entire sector at once.

3) Generate complete system (all planets and moons).

4) Generate World Tamers/Worldbuilders stats for worlds.

5) Add ability to import TEXT files.  (And if you want this one, _please_
send me information on file format for the files on the ftp sites, because I
don't have them.)

P.S. In deference to US copyright law, I won't be posting a copy of this
application to the Internet without GDW's permission.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 07:59:30 -0500
From: michel_v@cpx.Prograph.Com (Michel R. Vaillancourt; ACP)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Hot Brass
Message-ID: <9412011202.AA04142@Prograph.Com>

>Date: 29 Nov 94 15:34:29 EST
>From: Hugh Foster <100326.446@compuserve.com>
>To: "INTERNET:traveller@mpgn.com" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
>Subject: Guns, missiles, grenades
>Message-ID: <941129203428_100326.446_BHG74-5@CompuServe.COM>
>
>>> You don't need to have a bullpup to get a faceful of hot brass when shooting
>a rifle offhand. <<
>
>Takes me back. I remember getting a case in the mush while firing a P08
>Parabellum American Eagle one day - damn, it hurt! In those days there wasn't
>nearly the fuss about safety glasses on the range and I was quite unnerved by
>it. Happy days!

  I dunno....  On the Canadian C-7 (A Canuck variant of the M16A1A), we've
just put a brass deflector ( a little protrusion just aft of the ejector
port) which throws the brass out at 90 degrees to the barrel.  Lefties
shoot 'em all the time and don't get brass in the nose.
--
    -+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=-
 Michel Vaillancourt            Written from, not for:          
 "Live, Love, Learn"            Prograph International      
 MetroCity 2.0.2.0 BBS          2745 Dutch Village Rd,         
    902.835.9766                     Halifax, NS                
1:251/17@fidonet.org            "Watch your language!"          

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 08:43:04 -0500
From: michel_v@cpx.Prograph.Com (Michel R. Vaillancourt; ACP)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Deep Meson Sites and planetary defense
Message-ID: <9412011245.AA04196@Prograph.Com>

>Date: Tue, 29 Nov 1994 18:28:17 -0500 (EST)
>From: bc80076@bingsuns.cc.binghamton.edu
>To: traveller@MPGN.COM
>Subject: menson guns
>Message-ID: <9411292328.AA25571@bingsun1>
>
>Hi peoples
>        I am running a campaign that takes place on a pocket empire
>that is center on earth. They have a deep menson gun and they have one
>on one of the moons of jupiter and another on satern. These are
>"secret" sites as much as a menson gun can be secret. They provide
>earth with the ability to deprive fuel to anyone jumping in. They have
>self destrucuting mechanisms in them if they should be needed.
>        I had never seen a reason why a second "back up deep menson
>sight could not be created, besides the cost. 
>                Leigh O'Neil
>                bc80076@bingsuns.cc.binghamton.edu

        Based on TCS funding levels, whaddya mean "budget"?  You can easily
build a dozen guns (how about 1 per hour of rotation?  Plus 2 polar sites;
26 DMG's for Earth, for example) with the GNP of the USA.  Let alone the
REST of the planet.  Beef that up with laser satilites (solar panels,
batteries, small fusion reactor, and 5pts at 80 hexes...), say about 100
for Earth and surface missle silos (use my x-series missles; 2-stage: 20g
turns with 20gs an 80g turns with 10g's, 500MT charge for the DET laser... 
no, they aren't small, but they are planet launched).
        With a couple of scaled down installations near each of the Gas
Giants (you would need two or three per GG to prevent the battle station
being over the firing horizon from the intruders) you could mke life *very*
uncomforatble for an invader.
        Then, of course, you have your SDB's and raiders for harrasment
duty against the opposing fleet's escorts.  Take them out, one at a time,
and eventually the intruder will either have to commit his capital ships to
hunting them down, or to try and attack the bases.  Which is what you
want...  simply because you can build bigger guns than he can shields.
        Eventually you get re-enforced, or he gets fustrated enough that he
either leaves to cut his losses or he starts throwing rocks at you to try
and overwhelm your DefSat grid.  The first two result in a victory for you,
most likely, and the third has got 50-50 odds of going either way.  If he
ever hits you with a rock (which odds dicate he will, eventually), you
loose, but its 20 years before he can inhabit the planet (assuming he was
throwing big rocks).
        Let's face it, if you have a planet of 4 billion people, and the
"Free-Hold" tax (levied against the anual incoming of the person, to ensure
that the proud Star System of <insert name here> never falls to the
oppresionist yoke of <insert another name here>) is 100Cr per annum, that
is a budget of 400 Billion credits to build your system defense network. 
Given two or three years head start, the system I describe is very
feasible.  Which is why planetary invasions are extremely messy for the
invader, unless the invader doesn't care if he actually can use the planet
afterward. 
--
    -+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=-
 Michel Vaillancourt            Written from, not for:          
 "Live, Love, Learn"            Prograph International      
 MetroCity 2.0.2.0 BBS          2745 Dutch Village Rd,         
    902.835.9766                     Halifax, NS                
1:251/17@fidonet.org            "Watch your language!"          

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 13:58:53 +0000 (GMT)
From: count@easynet.co.uk
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Cc: lewis@chara.gsu.edu
Subject: Deep Meson Sites (Response)
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.90.941201135000.10298A-100000@master>


On Wed 23 Nov 94, Lewis Roberts talked about Deep Meson Sites,

I know that this is a TNE board, but Im on the other side of the world 
from my copy of TNE let alone a copy of FF&S or MT etc so bear with me.

In Striker (I) they suggested that this {'destroying the surface sensors'} 
was the only way to get rid of them.  Another I thought of was using a 
densitometer with sufficient depth penetration.  I cannot remember what 
the highest pen is in MT, or if they still exist in TNE...others may be 
able to confirm or deny this.

Anyway, just look for anomalous readings on your sensors...
Also what other particles are created from a meson reaction.  If there 
are neutrinos then use your local highly calibrated neutrino sensor.  I 
know this means that you have to wait for the gun to fire, but... you 
have to expect some losses!!!

//count@easynet.co.uk



------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 13:25:52 BST
From: Martin Fay <MFAY@fs2.cp.umist.ac.uk>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: Guns, guns, lovely guns
Message-ID: <425B7AD37AB@fs2.cp.umist.ac.uk>

Derek Smith wrote:
: There's nothing wrong with the Plasma Grenade, because:
: You don't *throw* grenades.  You *launch* grenades.

Hugh Foster wrote
> Very true. But if you're going to go to the effort of carrying the 
> launch mechanism as well, you might just as well go back to good 
> ol' FGMP. Which is what we did.

: Ever notice how easy it is to fire a FGMP *indirectly* ???

I had great fun raining death over Cheymaks from afar with a GL a 
couple of years ago. Indirect fire is one to really make the GM 
sweat, especially if you can get a neural activity sensor to aim with 
;-) Eh, roger ;-)

Another advantage of a GL over an FGMP is flexibility - did you ever 
hear of an FGMP firing flechete/gas/baton round/phosphorous/smoke? A 
GL can do a bit more than go bang!

And you don't *have* to have Battledress to fire most of them (I mean 
PGMP's etc), and they're lower tech: at TL15 the guidance on the 
grenades would probably be pretty awesome?

---------------------------------------------------------
T.Eldritch - Regency Intelligence Service - Regina/Regina
martin.fay@umist.ac.uk
---------------------------------------------------------
Nice gun, nice gun.....boom, boom, boom...oh no I nearly
killed the captain.


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 10:25:48 -0500
From: CyHiggin@aol.com
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: TRAVELLER digest 117
Message-ID: <941201102540_2952210@aol.com>

George:

>Oh, note to anyone who was in the game... do you still have the >charges I
brought against Sansterre around?  I may have lost my >copy 8-(

Wasn't that Serendip Belt, not Sansterre?  I don't recall Sansterre
doing anything particularly chargeable... In any case, we may have
the charges in the archives somewhere. I'll see if I can dig them
out.

From: Mark Clark
 
[on Alternate Vision..]
>Seems like a good reason for the change in physical laws would
>be various Black Weapons from Lucan's faction, designed to
>temporarily change local physical laws.

I will admit that the change in the physical constants governing
Gravitics are due to a sentient agency.  It is also a limited area
of effect -- say 1000-2000 parsecs.  Beyond there, the old
rules of the Universe apply.  This did bad things to communications
with the Zho Core Expedition, BTW... and there's a transition 
zone, where NO gravitics, old or new, work reliably.

As I postulated, the laws of Jumpspace did not change, it was
just that a lesser-known aspect of jump physics suddenly 
manifested itself... and that Imperial jump theory was slightly
flawed in the first place.
                          -- Cynthia


------------------------------

Date: Thu, 1 Dec 1994 10:02:37 -0700 (MST)
From: merrick@RT66.com (Merrick Burkhardt)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Re: Planetfall and Big Ships
Message-ID: <9412011702.AA15408@RT66.com>


Ooops.  I forgot to change the header.  I think I'll go play in the
fusion reactor now :)

-Merrick

------------------------------

End of TRAVELLER Digest 118
***************************
